Z-ABS Recycling

Hey,

It'd be really nice if we could recycle our filament. A lot of it goes onto failed or draft prints, and even larger amount onto support rafts.

I understand that we (as individuals) cannot do this (or can we?), but I think it'd be really cool if Zortrax would sponsor, own, or support recyclers (at least 1 on each continent where printer is sold) - where we could send in our scraps and get real fillament back (or at least credits TOWARDS purchasing a new roll).

Thoughts?

It's a nice idea, but I suspect that a company the size of Zortrax just doesn't have the resources to justify trying it.  Then too, it probably isn't cost effective to separate ABS by color so batches of recycled ABS would probably each have slightly different colors and might not have much value, at least for 3D printing where users would probably want very consistent color.  Different brands of ABS might also have different constituents, further diluting the quality of the recycled ABS.

Those are just guesses on my part though.

Mike

+ plastic's characteristics changes when you recycle it and that could affect print quality.

It's a very large problem and well beyond the scope of what zortrax is concerned with. Moreover, I don't see the reason for the manufacturer to be associated with a company to recycle their product. With that said, there is no reason you couldn't go straight to such a company; there are several that I have seen trying to start up. 

It's a nice idea, but I suspect that a company the size of Zortrax just doesn't have the resources to justify trying it.  Then too, it probably isn't cost effective to separate ABS by color so batches of recycled ABS would probably each have slightly different colors and might not have much value, at least for 3D printing where users would probably want very consistent color.  Different brands of ABS might also have different constituents, further diluting the quality of the recycled ABS.

Those are just guesses on my part though.

Mike

I mostly agree with you. The two situations I could see it is to run cheap prototypes for basic testing before running it with more expensive filament, and using it in dual-extruder setups as support material. There would also probably be a market simply because it's a recycled product; I'm going to be joining a farmers market this summer in a hippy town and I'm sure they'd love seeing some recycled plastic products.

Good thoughts! ;)

I have design files for a Lyman Filament Extruder if you want. Pretty decent machine.  ____--If anyone wants the files, email me or message me and I will send them to you. Cheers 

I just hadn't had the energy to go get the stuff and make it. Plus to make it worth while would need a bunch of raw material. 

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Cool :)

I mostly agree with you. The two situations I could see it is to run cheap prototypes for basic testing before running it with more expensive filament, and using it in dual-extruder setups as support material. There would also probably be a market simply because it's a recycled product; I'm going to be joining a farmers market this summer in a hippy town and I'm sure they'd love seeing some recycled plastic products.

There was a project about 20 years ago to do recycling on US textile dyebaths.  The salt in the spent dyebaths was relatively easy to recover, but there was no way to economically recover the individual dyes, which was worth more than the salt on a total $ basis.  The only logical solution was to recover a mixture of the dyes, which usually ended up as a brownish-black color with a very inconsistent color spectrum.  About the only use was dyeing the plastics in plastic garbage bags because almost no one cares what color they are.  

You'd probably have a similar problem with recycled filament - the color would vary too much for it to have much value.  Hippies may have great heart, but they aren't known for having a lot of disposable income.

Mike

I backed a plastic grinding machine on Kickstarter which I’ll use to grind up all my waste filament into small pieces and I already have a filament extruder from a previous KS. Because of that I have been saving all of my waste rafts, supports and failed prints over the past year so they can be reused later.

I know the properties won’t be as good as new filament but it would be nice to use for prototypes or decorative items. I could also mix colors together to make new colors or make multicolor filament by changing from one to another.

I backed a plastic grinding machine on Kickstarter which I'll use to grind up all my waste filament into small pieces and I already have a filament extruder from a previous KS. Because of that I have been saving all of my waste rafts, supports and failed prints over the past year so they can be reused later.

I know the properties won’t be as good as new filament but it would be nice to use for prototypes or decorative items. I could also mix colors together to make new colors or make multicolor filament by changing from one to another.

So that means we can send all our rafts and failed prints to you for reuse? 

hehe 

I backed a plastic grinding machine on Kickstarter which I'll use to grind up all my waste filament into small pieces and I already have a filament extruder from a previous KS. Because of that I have been saving all of my waste rafts, supports and failed prints over the past year so they can be reused later.

I know the properties won’t be as good as new filament but it would be nice to use for prototypes or decorative items. I could also mix colors together to make new colors or make multicolor filament by changing from one to another.

So that means we can send all our rafts and failed prints to you for reuse? 

hehe 

[url=http://minus.com/i/li9R0OnTM84g]jli9R0OnTM84g.jpg[/URL] :rolleyes:

I keep all the rafts and failed prints hoping that some day i will recycle it

Have you ever had a filament reel that just wants to strip out and de-laminate? If so then it is a high possibility that filament reel batch had a heightened amount of "Regrind", Regrind is exactly what we are talking about in this case. If you exceed a cretin amount of regrind in a batch you get a lot of problems that end up leading to bad filament. I believe the magic death number is somewhere around 20% (Ill have to find out from one of my suppliers), there have been pushes from some companies to make machines that can recycle the extruded plastic, the problem is that the properties of the filament have now changed and it is much harder to use now. At this point in time I have not heard of anyone successfully reusing regrind at a higher level than 20%, even the injection molding people don't use it and they have had decades of practice, they have had a lot more to loose than any printer manufacturer or end user like us. I would have figured they would find a solution quickly being they could save hundreds of thousands a year.

So in all, you can regrind your material at 1 part regrind and 4 parts virgin material, but at the end of the day you end up with much weaker parts and a lot of time and effort used.

-Michael

I would think that adjusting the temp up a few degrees would be fine for reclaimed material. I am sure it may be less versatile but still decent enough for something that isn't going to be handled a whole lot.

Another thing to mention here is that Zortrax M200 doesn't have spring loaded extruder like RepRaps and some other printers. And that is definitely not good if you want to use filament with high tolerances and poor roundness which homemade definitely is. Even big companies with expensive machines have problems to make almost perfect round filament with tolerances in range +/- 0.05mm.

Unfortunately no, adjusting the temp will not solve the problems, trust me I know this one well. We have had to send shipments back to our suppliers because of these problems. We have withheld thousands of spools from going out because of a regrind problem (this was over a year and a half ago and we do not work with said supplier any more). Think of Filament with regrind this way, you are mixing hard and soft chocolate together, the soft is your base product and you are introducing the hard chocolate as your "Regrind",  they may be the same chocolate and they may mix together to make a bar, but you will always have harder spots and softer spots. They will never truly mix and you cannot adjust to accommodate the constantly changing texture. This is the best way I can think of it right now. 

The regrind is not consistent throughout the spool, there will be better spots and worse spots, you will never be able to predict the flow or the temp. If you would like I can post a video of what a regrind spool looks like, I think I still have one sitting around here somewhere, and the problems it can cause in prints. 

-Michael

At first, I kept rafts and supports from each color and material in separate mason jars with acetone for glue. After I filled about a dozen of those without really using any, I started putting my scraps in a drawer pending my eventually building a filastruder. After I learned that plastic goes to hell after recycling and it's probably asking too much for tight tolerances from DIY equipment, I just started throwing the stuff out.

Oh, and my local recycling service doesn't like ABS, so that's shot too. Landfill it is.

At first, I kept rafts and supports from each color and material in separate mason jars with acetone for glue. After I filled about a dozen of those without really using any, I started putting my scraps in a drawer pending my eventually building a filastruder. After I learned that plastic goes to hell after recycling and it's probably asking too much for tight tolerances from DIY equipment, I just started throwing the stuff out.

Oh, and my local recycling service doesn't like ABS, so that's shot too. Landfill it is.

:(  :angry:  :angry:   

Just put in a bag and put in with recycling. Landfills are no good. It is always best to give the appearance you care about the environment.

It is recyclable and can be melted down and put into other products. Just cause you can't or don't want to reuse it does not mean it is landfill material. 

If your particular recycle guy has an issue just tell him you will contact his superiors and I bet he will change his tune

:(

:(  :angry:  :angry:   

Just put in a bag and put in with recycling. Landfills are no good. It is always best to give the appearance you care about the environment.

It is recyclable and can be melted down and put into other products. Just cause you can't or don't want to reuse it does not mean it is landfill material. 

If your particular recycle guy has an issue just tell him you will contact his superiors and I bet he will change his tune

:(

It isn't because my recycling guy is lazy, it's because the recycling company has a list of approved plastics and ABS is not one of them. Maybe there's special equipment for recycling ABS that they don't have or something. Either way, it ends up in a landfill whether I put it in the trash or the recycling company puts it in the trash.

50px-Plastic-recyc-abs.svg.png #9 or #ABS      Acrylonitrile butadiene styrene Monitor/TV cases, coffee makers, cell phones, most computer plastic

With the world's oceans being infested with plastics, I am heart broken at the lack of recycling programs around the world. It is just saddening. Plastics Recycling

I know I would love to start a plastics recycling place but it takes cold hard cash. When I had my scrap metal recycling business I used to take plastics no one else would take, like drainage pipes) and in bulk they are worth money and will be taken by the large plastic recyclers but so bulky they need to be crushed to be worth the cost of transport.

I will be collecting all the parts and making that filament extruder for myself. It may take a bit to do that and the current landscaping gig I am working on but I will get er done. lol 

I will let you know how the filament from the "scraps" work out!

Fun Fun!